Putin -Russia-Nuclear forces on high Alert

[catseye]

You probably should close this thread, in life there will always be people on both sides of an argument and those on the fence that are neutral. If Mr X has one view and Mr Y has another, sooner or later those views will come out and Mr X and Mr Y will end up arguing with each other. This is a Sat forum and there are plenty other forums on the internet where lefties or people with a centrist or right wing view can argue with each other. In my own observations I have noticed most of the cancel culture and those with unhinged views tend to be on the left, where as the right wing side seem to be more accepting of the views of others. The centrists don't really care either way.

In war you always have at least two sides and they both have their own opinions, If you look at a map of NATO countries from 1980 up to now you will see a massive expansion eastwards, UK/USA and other NATO countries have invaded other countries based on lies (Iraq (non existent WMD's) and Afghanistan (most bombers came from UAE)) and have helped destroy others Libya (overthrow Gaddafi), so we are not as innocent when it comes to invading others and Russia can see this as double standards and are no doubt worried about NATO expanding further onto it's borders. Then you have the Ukraine side and everything that goes with that. If you're pro Ukraine you will take the Ukraine side, if you're pro Russia you will take the Russian side. Personally I don't care either way regarding who's on the right side, which seems to miff some other people off. One things for sure and that's my bills have gone up, and generally that's all I care about and I hope this all gets sorted soon and my bills come down.

Its always the innocent that suffer
I agree we as a country are not whiter than white
The middle east for all its faults was relatively stable for many years
Western Liberalism as gone to far with so much nonsense especially coming from the US

We as non multi millionaires (dont think there are any on this board) will end up paying the price as usual
9/11 had nowt to do with ordinary Afghans (who are no better off now than 20 years ago)

[TonyO]

I would normally agree that there are two sides to every debate or argument, this does not seem to apply to this situation where one big strong country invades another smaller sovereign country by brute force and untold military violence to occupy and enslave a whole nation.

And for what ! just to restore the old Soviet empire that collapsed under its corruption and injustices and lack of accountability by the ruling thugs.

There are not two sides to this argument, just right and wrong.

[mrdude]

I would normally agree that there are two sides to every debate or argument, this does not seem to apply to this situation where one big strong country invades another smaller sovereign country by brute force and untold military violence to occupy and enslave a whole nation.

And for what ! just to restore the old Soviet empire that collapsed under its corruption and injustices and lack of accountability by the ruling thugs.

There are not two sides to this argument, just right and wrong.

There's been things that have gone on with Ukraine and Russia for years now. I watched a video on Reddit where a bunch of Ukrainian Soldiers tortured a Russian soldier, nailed him to a crucifix and then set him on fire while he was still alive, that happened a while back and these two sides have been taunting each other for a long time now. You don't see this on the main stream media though because generally this kind of thing happens in many countries and never makes it to the news. Currently and in all wars we also have a Misinformation/Disinformation and propaganda war being fought alongside the regular war fighting - guess what side the Western main stream media is on?

I don't agree with Russia invading Ukraine, I also don't agree with poking a sleeping bear with a stick because it's eventually going to wake up and give you a reaction, probably one you won't like. I won't post any videos of war crimes or post any links to anything, but from what I have seen, some Ukraine soldiers are not the heroes you might think they are, some are truly appalling human beings. Just the same as everywhere - you have good people and bad people and the innocents get dragged into things and suffer through no fault of their own. Also remember that many of the Russian soldiers are conscripts and have zero choice on the matter, they are told what to do and if they don't do it they will be shipped off to the gulag and that will be the end of them. It's easy to judge everyone by western standards and expect them to do as we do, in reality Russia is not a western country and neither is Ukraine and they have their own standards that they live by, the west shouldn't be poking it's nose into this as Ukraine is not a NATO member, just the same as we shouldn't be poking our nose into some African countries wars or some in central America or Asia or the middle east etc. Let them fight it out on their own terms, we shouldn't be getting involved as it's none of our business.

[TonyO]

That answer sounds like a justification for the Invasion, surely the people that live in a country should be able to choose democratically how they want to run it, not the violent bully on the block !

The Russian Empire has gone back to believing "Might Is Right", the reason the EU and NATO have looked in the other direction shouldn't be that they fear that Russia will get even nastier if challenged reeks of appeasement, we know what happened the last time this policy was adopted.

[holmroad]

I would normally agree that there are two sides to every debate or argument, this does not seem to apply to this situation where one big strong country invades another smaller sovereign country by brute force and untold military violence to occupy and enslave a whole nation.

And for what ! just to restore the old Soviet empire that collapsed under its corruption and injustices and lack of accountability by the ruling thugs.

There are not two sides to this argument, just right and wrong.

Totally agree Tony - just what I posted earlier but think it was taken down - all I'd said was 'two sides?'

[mrdude]

That answer sounds like a justification for the Invasion, surely the people that live in a country should be able to choose democratically how they want to run it, not the violent bully on the block !

If you read any history books since the beginning of recorded history you'll find that this sort of thing has been happening since day dot. Whether we agree with it or not doesn't change that. It happens in every species as well from wolves, lions, the sea etc - the apex predator and the strongest of those always gets to run the show and eat everything else it wants until something bigger and stronger eats it - this is just nature and how it's always been and always will be.

I don't justify any invasions and wish we could all get along but there will always be some bully that lives on a block that will steal your sweets/money or make life miserable for you until you get stronger than them or have more friends and over power them - these are just facts of life.

The west should be taking notes now, especially NATO countries and spending the proper amount on their forces, equipment and training. The globalists in governments should be hanging their heads in shame because they allowed our country to be dependant on others for manufacturing, energy and food etc - this is all down to human greed of course and trying to get something cheaper from elsewhere without thinking about the long term consequences.

As for Ukraine/Russia - I don't have a dog in this fight and won't be picking sides either, they are as bad as each other in my book. I just feel sorry for the innocents on both sides that are suffering through no fault of their own. It's a pity the people starting the wars (the politicians) won't be doing any of the fighting themselves or will be sending their own kids to their premature deaths, because if they did need to do that there would be a lot less wars in this world.

Also democracy is an illusion, you might vote for a certain party but they rarely carry out the promises they made when they asked for your vote - looking at Canada and Trudeau, that man was voted in, he's a dictator and only out for himself, same with the Swamp in Washington - how many of these politicians have become very rich since being elected. As for countries invading others - we should take a look at ourselves before judging others, we have been doing that for hundreds of years. The British empire didn't become powerful because we went to other countries and asked their leaders nicely if they wanted to join us, and If you look at recent history since the end of WW2 we can't really be the ones to be lecturing others when we have done a fair bit of invading and overthrowing ourselves.

[catseye]

If you read any history books since the beginning of recorded history you'll find that this sort of thing has been happening since day dot. Whether we agree with it or not doesn't change that. It happens in every species as well from wolves, lions, the sea etc - the apex predator and the strongest of those always gets to run the show and eat everything else it wants until something bigger and stronger eats it - this is just nature and how it's always been and always will be.

I don't justify any invasions and wish we could all get along but there will always be some bully that lives on a block that will steal your sweets/money or make life miserable for you until you get stronger than them or have more friends and over power them - these are just facts of life.

The west should be taking notes now, especially NATO countries and spending the proper amount on their forces, equipment and training. The globalists in governments should be hanging their heads in shame because they allowed our country to be dependant on others for manufacturing, energy and food etc - this is all down to human greed of course and trying to get something cheaper from elsewhere without thinking about the long term consequences.

As for Ukraine/Russia - I don't have a dog in this fight and won't be picking sides either, they are as bad as each other in my book. I just feel sorry for the innocents on both sides that are suffering through no fault of their own. It's a pity the people starting the wars (the politicians) won't be doing any of the fighting themselves or will be sending their own kids to their premature deaths, because if they did need to do that there would be a lot less wars in this world.

Also democracy is an illusion, you might vote for a certain party but they rarely carry out the promises they made when they asked for your vote - looking at Canada and Trudeau, that man was voted in, he's a dictator and only out for himself, same with the Swamp in Washington - how many of these politicians have become very rich since being elected. As for countries invading others - we should take a look at ourselves before judging others, we have been doing that for hundreds of years. The British empire didn't become powerful because we went to other countries and asked their leaders nicely if they wanted to join us, and If you look at recent history since the end of WW2 we can't really be the ones to be lecturing others when we have done a fair bit of invading and overthrowing ourselves.

You make some excellent points especially about globalisation
Ive been saying the same for years

[Detlef]

There was a very interesting imterview with an International Criminal Court (ICC) lawyer on the beeb this afternoon.

He said that there is already undisputable evidence that Putin has committed severe war crimes.

The ICC will now indict Putin so that he can never leave the Russian Federation without being arrested.

[TonyO]

Putin wants his name in history as the dictator who restored by violence the Russian Empire back to its former borders of Russian speakers, imagine if the UK or USA used the same argument to invade other English speaking ex-colonial countries, we would be pilloried and shamed rightly so by the whole world.

Western lefty media and politicians are already using all sorts of excuses to play down the invasion as an act of Russian self defence against a democratic sovereign nation describing them as Neo Nazi's, the only Nazi's here are the red ones that use force to solve every thing they don’t like, democracy is there biggest threat as no one ever by choice voted the communists in who normally take control by brute force not by popular voting.

[welshpaddy]

Mossad would be the boys to take him out

[catseye]

Latest threats mentioned have been turning off the gas supply to Europe

The Russians exploding a non nuclear bomb over the sea that would be powerful enough to knock out the power supplies

How would the kids cope ?

[holmroad]

WHAT a mess

[ian]

What I dont understand is why Ukraine doesn't attack Russia whilst it still can ? It wont ever win, but why not take the war to them ?
And make the Russains experience missile attacks and bombings of their cities. Russian Joe public might not then be so much in favour of this war and could rise up to depose Putin. At the very least they should surely have attacked that convoy as it was approching the capital ?

But hey what do I know.

Ian.

[Barney]

Putin is suffering from terminal Cancer and is taking heavy medication which is sending him more and more crazy by the day it is no excuse for his madness just an explanation i guess ?
He has been kept hidden like the vermin rat he is in his underground bunker well below the surface highly protected , the media is not permitted to show just how much protection surrounds him on a 24/7 daily basis just like the Russian people that are fed only the news and media that Putin wants them to hear insinuating that Ukraine people are evil Neo Nazis and even telling them Ukrainians are the root cause of Covid with biological Labs hidden inside Ukraine .

Putin should never have gotten hold of those power plants now he can dictate to the world not vice versa , the critical right time to attack Putin has already long gone ...he was at his very most vulnerable when his colony of tanks were all preoccupied approaching those power plants , that was the time for the West to launch a full on attack and shell the crap outta Russia and send in a sniper crew to take out Putin when he was very vulnerable and he was using his trump card [ ie. his false claims of nuclear warfare ] .
But sure enuff everyone sat on their hands and basically handed Putin total and utter control and full ability to dictate what he likes to Europe and the US , the sanctions is clearly a laughing joke and going to have zero effect on stopping or slowing Putin short term .

From now on wards Putin now tells Brits , EU and US exactly what they will be doing not vice versa , he decided to take control of chernobyl and Zaporizhzhya Nuclear Power Plant with really no effort at all , so now Putin can make any threat he desires and whatever his demands are going to be , you already know they will all be granted regardless of how insane and crazy they might well turn out to be .

Putin may be critically ill but he will have Alexander Lukashenko fully behind him to carry out his efforts at world domination ,
This 'invasion' scenario is just the beginning of just how serious a threat Russia will become i believe .

[catseye]

Blew a base up approx 40 miles from Poland

Trying harder & harder to revenge those countries that broke from the USSR back in '91

[CokeAddict]

Blew a base up approx 40 miles from Poland

Trying harder & harder to revenge those countries that broke from the USSR back in '91

Nope, he's just pushing the limits, he wants Nato to step in.

Won't be long before he just fires into Poland, or Latvia to force it.